This is the last day of the last year before Hungary’s accession to the EU. What have been the most important achievements and setbacks of the past year in terms of foreign policy?

László Kovács Speaking about the last day of a year that we exist outside the European Union (EU), I don’t think there is reason to celebrate, because it is the last day of a long and troubled history of Hungary. We are certainly going to celebrate the first of January, which is the first day of the year when we become part of the European Union, as well as the first of May 2004. It is a long expected dream of Hungary and the Hungarian people, because for decades we had been isolated from the family of democratic nations.

László Kovács pulls the strings of Hungarian politics

As far as 2003 is concerned, among the major achievements of Hungarian foreign policy, first of all, that we had a referendum with 84 percent voting “Yes” to the accession of Hungary to the European Union. A couple of days later we signed the accession agreement between Hungary and the EU. And since Apr. 16, the date of signing the accession treaty, we have been participating in the activities of the European Union as active observers.
Another important success was the amendment to the so-called benefit law, or as the former government called it, the status law. I mention this because it generated some tensions between Hungary and the neighboring countries, and was not welcomed by the EU, as it did not coincide with European standards. In 2003, we managed to amend the benefit law to bring it into harmony with European standards and norms.
While I do not think there were any real setbacks for Hungarian foreign policy, one may be that while we have all made all efforts to complete the formulation of a new constitution treaty for the European Union, the summit meetings in Brussels failed to come to a final solution.

We have just witnessed the elections in Serbia, with a victory by Seselj’s party. The results has prompted many analysts to express worry. What impacts do you think these results will have on the EU, Hungarian and Serbian rapprochement, as well as the effect on the Hungarian minority in Vojvodina.

László Kovács The bad news is that the ultra-nationalist party of Seselj won the elections. The good news is that they do not have absolute majority. I do hope there will be a coalition of democratic parties, though the party of Seselj will have a very strong position in the Serbian legislature. The other bad news is that the Hungarian parties failed to qualify.
What we expect first is that the new Serbian government will maintain the democratic political orientation of the country and will maintain the Euro-Atlantic orientation of Serbia’s foreign policy. And then in harmony with this, we expect no setbacks for Hungarian minorities if it is a democratic government.

Slovakia is now undergoing significant economic reform by introducing a flat tax rate. Many business analysts are now eyeing Slovakia as the next economic tiger. With a very high taxation level, high value added tax rates and rising wages, how will Hungary stay competitive?

László Kovács I am absolutely certain that we have to introduce an overall tax reform, and the sooner the better. The position of the HSP is that the government should introduce tax reform for the next fiscal year, 2005, at the latest.

With a similar flat tax rate?

László Kovács Not exactly. We have to reduce the levels of taxation considerably. The corporate tax used to be 18 percent, and now it is 16 percent. In 2004, it will be 14 percent, and by 2005, only 12. Therefore the corporate tax will be reduced by one-third over three years. We also cut the personal income tax, and while it was not a major cut, it is now lower than it used to be. We have to make an overall tax reform that would make it more fair, meaning that those who earn more, should pay more.

In the run-up to the creation of the unresolved EU Constitution, the inclusion of Christianity in the preamble was a point of debate. The Hungarian government quietly supported the notion. Does the potential inclusion of such a clause risk alienating non-Christians and question the separation of church and state?

The Christianity clause will likely to be rejected by EU, says Kovács

László Kovács The two Hungarian opposition parties in parliament, the young Democrats and the Democratic Forum, strongly supported the implementation of a reference to Christian heritage in the European Constitution. The position of the government was that we would not go against it, but we would not play any active role in supporting it for two reasons. The first reason was that we did not want harm our vital issue – minority rights – because our estimation was that one country cannot take on more than one important issue.

As a foreign minister of Hungary who attended all the meetings of the foreign ministers in recent months and who participated in the debate on the drafting of the constitutional treaty, I understood that there was no major hope to have it accepted. There were some five or six countries that were strongly supporting the inclusion of a reference to Christian heritage, and there were more or less the same number of countries who were very strongly arguing against it; speaking about the importance of the secularity of European states. There were also many arguments raised against it, because in Europe there are some non-Christian communities. There are Jews, there are Muslims and there are some other non-Christian religions. So I think, finally it will not be included in the final text of the constitutional treaty.

DT recently visited Roma communities where a leader of one community criticized the Hungarian government for prioritizing the protection of minorities abroad, while neglecting those at home. We also visited a settlement called Hétes, and the living conditions witnessed were indeed untenable. We encountered a very bright young girl, Szilvi, who was embittered by her fate and the fact she has little chance to live life outside this settlement. What is your message to this girl and those community leaders?

László Kovács My message to the Roma community is that they should trust the current government. We take it very seriously to provide opportunities for the Roma community to catch up with the Hungarian majority. Of course it takes much longer than one or two years, but we made the first steps. We elaborated an immediate strategy, which the EU knows and appreciates. I think that the cornerstone of bettering the situation of the Roma community is education, not only providing jobs, which it is the second step. The first step should be the education, because you cannot provide fair jobs to non-qualified people. So education is the key issue.
To Szilvi, personally, my message is that I know of a Roma girl who is a bit older than her, she is in her late 20s. She is now general director of the Roma Information Center in Brussels, which is the Roma information center of the European Union. She is Angela Cotroaza, who was one of the contenders and finally got the job.
I am very proud of her. She has different university degrees and a degree in the English language, using English as the working language in the Roma Information Center. I think Szilvi should take Angela as a positive example.

On the question of Iraq, are you as comfortable today with the decision to support the war in Iraq as you were before the war? To date, the infamous weapons of mass destruction have still not been found.

László Kovács The weapons of mass destruction were not found so far, but at the same time Saddam Hussein was also not found for a long time, until he was finally captured. I think that it will certainly ease the stabilization process in Iraq. And it can also result in finding the weapons of mass destruction.

Defence Minister Juhász (left) said troops could return fom Iraq, but Kovács disagrees

You are still confident they will be found?

László Kovács I am confident because what I know, and what everybody knows, is that Iraq used extensive weapons of mass destruction. Iraq used some chemical weapons against its own population, against the Kurdish people and in the war against Iran.

Yet the war was fought under the pretext of Iraq being a direct threat to the United States and the coalition.

László Kovács No one knew exactly what kind of weapons of mass destruction Iraq was hiding and is still hiding. I think that the risk was too high, and from this point of view I understood the decision of the US administration to be on the safe side, and that it was better to make a preemptive operation. What is the outcome? The outcome is that there is no longer an oppressive regime in Iraq. Saddam Hussein is gone and his regime has fallen, and now there is a chance to rebuild Iraq as a new democratic country.

But just a few days ago scores were injured and several killed, four Bulgarians among them. On a daily basis there are still attacks. Should Hungarian forces end up coming home in body bags? Will Hungary remove its troops?

László Kovács On such issues, I am not ready to answer any question that starts with if, because I am not a fortuneteller.

The government’s defense minister, however, is on record for having said that if the Hungarian contingent is in a situation of war, the troops will be withdrawn.

László Kovács You should address your question to him, and not to me. It was not the position of the Hungarian government. It was his views that he expressed at a press conference weeks ago, when no one could see the light at the end of the tunnel.

In recent months, there has been a tug-of-war between the government and some heads of institutions that are supposed to be independent of the control of the government. I am talking in particular of the Szász case. In recent weeks, the law on the Hungarian Financial Supervisory Authority (PSZÁF) law was sent to the constitutional court by the president. It was subsequently criticized by some senior European analysts.

László Kovács First, we have to clarify what we mean by the independence of certain institutions. Certainly the financial watchdog, PSZÁF, is not independent. It is independent in certain ways, but it is under the control of the Minister of Finance, and its president is elected by a simple parliamentary majority. Recently, some new information came out from a dismissed head of the department of the institution, that had some very serious allegations against the president of this institution . He stated that Szász really launched a political campaign, using the means and the possibilities of the institution against the Minister of Finance, against some other prominent officials of the government and leaders of the government parties. If it proves to be true, then it is a very serious, because in that case it will prove that the independence of this institution was very strongly violated by the president itself, who used it as a political device against the government.

Do you assign responsibility on the part of the institution for not having discovered the laundering of billions of forints? Is it your belief that this is the result of incompetence on the part of the staff?

László Kovács Yes, because this money laundering started – according to all of the information – at least four or five years ago, and this institution had no information about it. That is the first point. The second point is that if it will finally be confirmed that this money laundering started some five years ago, can you imagine that this money laundering was started by politicians of an opposition party? It’s simply impossible. When there is some leakage to the press, some names or persons that are claimed to be involved – they are only names belonging mostly to HSP. When for instance, during the investigation, the diary of Attila Kulcsár was found and some names were also leaked to the press, who were the persons whose names were found in this diary? They were only politicians of HSP and entrepreneurs close to HSP. Can you imagine that the broker had clients only from one side of the political arena? It is simply impossible.

You are a man with an incredible background and with many years of service under different regimes. How do you, personally, reconcile today representing a government that champions causes your former regime reviled? I refer to the values of the system that capitalism and America represents, that were detested by the governments you served in high postings under the former regime?

László Kovács In the 1970s, I served in the international department of the central committee of what was then, the only party. My job was to establish relations with the social democratic parties of Western Europe. I studied very carefully the activities of social democratic parties and activities on the socialist international [scene]. I am now the vice president of the Socialist International. In the second half of the 1970s, I first got into contact with the social democratic leaders of the West. In the 1980s, when I became deputy foreign minister, my responsibility was Hungary’s relations with Western countries. I always worked on improving relations with the US, Canada and Western European countries. I did believe in the importance of my job, I always thought that Hungary should get as close to the then-European Economic Community as possible. I started to have, with the help of the SPD in Germany, confidential talks with the former member of the commission responsible for international relations of Europe’s communities – on how to establish contacts between COMECON [economic organization of the former Socialist countries, dissolved in 1991] member Hungary and the European Economic Community. The first confidential talks started in 1982, and were officially established in 1985. We made use of the three years, when there was a leadership vacuum in the Soviet Union. It was then, in 1982, when we entered the World Bank and the IMF.

So basically you did not believe in the very system that you served?

László Kovács No. I didn’t know when we could change it. Finally, it went much easier and faster then I expected. But to complete this story, in 1985 we had already opened official talks with the European Community. In 1988, two years before the political transition, we already signed an agreement on full-scale diplomatic relations between the COMECON member Hungary and the European Community.

But the most logical question, is if you believe in the direction now? If , as you say, you did not believe then, why should we we feel that you believe now?

László Kovács Yes I do, because this direction is based on the principles that I did believe, and do believe in. I was one of those who established the new HSP, on social democratic principles. What I am doing now fully coincides with my convictions and my faith.